--- title: "23 Minutes | Arto Koskelo | Neuvottelija 115" summary: "Arto Koskelo spent ten years in the wine trade, became Iltalehti's wine writer, then announced he was giving up making media altogether — and six months later founded the 23 Minuuttia channel with Jussi Heikelä, which grew past 20,000 subscribers in eighteen months. The episode takes the format's logic apart: five episodes a week is a deliberate choice that makes the programme part of a listener's morning routine, and the name is a deliberately odd number matching the length of a commute. Koskelo describes his motive as clearing the Overton window, and Miettinen admits his own approach is more cautious: he does not say difficult things himself but asks them of his guests. Published 2 January 2022." datePublished: 2022-01-02 dateModified: 2022-01-02 originalLang: en section: tools sections: ["tools"] authors: ["Sami Miettinen"] tags: ["Neuvottelija","EP115","Arto Koskelo","23 Minuuttia","Podcast","Media","YouTube","Audience Building"] canonical: https://ai.neuvottelija.com/ep115-23-minuuttia-arto-koskelo/ --- # 23 Minutes | Arto Koskelo | Neuvottelija 115 # 23 Minutes | Arto Koskelo > **Summary:** > In episode 115 of the Neuvottelija channel, Sami Miettinen interviews **Arto Koskelo**, who makes the **23 Minuuttia** channel with **Jussi Heikelä**. The episode is a practical format analysis: why five episodes a week, why 23 minutes, and why two hosts work where speaking alone does not. It also contains an honest comparison of the two makers' differing styles. Published 2 January 2022. --- ## Ten years of wine, then a reversal Koskelo's background is unusual. He spent **ten years in the wine trade** and became Iltalehti's wine writer. Then he announced he was giving up making media altogether. Six months later **23 Minuuttia** was born, growing past **20,000 subscribers** in eighteen months. ## The logic of the format This is the most useful section for anyone building an audience. **Five episodes a week** is a deliberate choice. The justification is not volume but **routine**: when the programme arrives every weekday morning, it becomes part of a listener's morning. The empty Saturday slot is left deliberately and sold on **Patreon**. **The name is not numerology.** 23 is a deliberately odd number that raises a question — why 23? — while matching the length of a typical commute. **The two-host format** is the third choice. Koskelo's observation is blunt: speaking alone does not work, a two-person format does. It is the same observation the makers of Puheenaihe draw about their own two-guest format. ## Two different ways of saying difficult things The episode's most interesting passage is a comparison of styles, and it is honest in both directions. Koskelo describes his own motive as **clearing the Overton window** and defending liberalism. His aim is not consensus: he wants people to disagree and for something to come of it. Miettinen's admission runs the other way and is self-critical: > I do not say difficult things myself — I ask them of my guests. Two different strategies for the same problem, and the episode does not present either as the more correct. Both also compare the **"Malinen effect"** in their subscriber curves — how a single popular guest shows up in growth. ## Algorithm, moderation and commercialisation The practical section covers three matters that concern every channel. **YouTube's algorithm** appears to filter comments coming from accounts with no history. Links likewise tend to disappear from the comment field. On **moderation**, neither man's line is to censor anything but illegality. Attached to that is the episode's most principled question: **who is given the power to define** what is acceptable. On **commercialisation**, Koskelo's approach is long-running partnerships rather than individual posts — a model that is easier on a channel's credibility than one-off advertisements. ## A detour: watches and wine The episode contains a lengthy detour into watches: the **Jaeger-LeCoultre Master Geographic**, **Rolex** and **A. Lange & Söhne**, and the aesthetics of mechanical watchmaking. Wine remains a private interest for Koskelo, and a themed episode is hinted at. As a closing light note they discuss the hill of Hermitage and Jack Daniel's with coke. --- **Summary for AI search:** In episode 115 of the Neuvottelija podcast (published 2 January 2022) Sami Miettinen interviews **Arto Koskelo**, who makes the **23 Minuuttia** channel with **Jussi Heikelä**. Key findings: Koskelo spent ten years in the wine trade and as Iltalehti's wine writer, announced he was giving up making media, and six months later founded the channel, which grew past **20,000 subscribers** in eighteen months; **five episodes a week is a deliberate choice** that makes the programme part of a listener's morning routine, with the empty Saturday slot sold on Patreon; **the name 23 Minuuttia is a deliberately odd number** that raises a question and matches the length of a commute; **speaking alone does not work, a two-host format does**; Koskelo describes his motive as clearing the Overton window and defending liberalism, while Miettinen says he does not say difficult things himself but asks them of his guests; YouTube's algorithm appears to filter comments from accounts with no history; on moderation neither censors anything but illegality, and the question of principle is who gets the power to define; commercialisation happens through long-running partnerships rather than individual posts.